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Firstlook Agreement - Edmunds & JD Powers sure want a lot of info!

Discussion in 'Vehicle Merchandising & Inventory Software' started by Eley Duke, May 11, 2011.

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  1. Eley Duke

    Eley Duke
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    We have just signed on with Firstlook and I am reading the Edmunds Data Polling and License Agreement along with the JD Powers PIN Agreement. No wonder every Tom, Dick, and Harry are well armed before they ever walk into our dealerships! I am a little concerned at the amount of information both these agreements want to poll from our DMS systems, it seems its a whole lot of information leaving our dealership regarding sales transactions.

    Edmunds has 4 pages of data they want to poll, from financed amount, dealer cost, invoice, buy rate, etc. JD Powers agreement says they have authorization to "access and extract, or have extracted by a third party retained by PIN, vehicle sales data from Dealer’s computer systems (including, without limitation, sales, leaseand finance information)." JD Powers doesnt even list the data they want, hello!

    Edmunds doesnt give any info as to what they give in return. JD Powers list the following;

    New/Used Customer Sales Google​
    TM Map
    – Like “Pins on a map,†graphically shows where your
    customers are coming from

    • ​
    Customer Sales by Zip Code – Have your marketing and sales efforts impacted your new car sales
    performance? Two reports allow you to see all sales by Zip or compare two time periods and a
    geographical area to see your new car sales numbers (broken down by Zip code).

    • ​
    New Vehicle Franchise Performance – pricing, profit and other performance measurements for
    nameplates selling in your market.

    • ​
    New & Used Vehicle Average Deal Recap – retail and lease performance details for your franchise versus the average franchise (same nameplate) in your market.

    • ​
    New Vehicle Return on Inventory Report – your inventory performance relative to the average
    same-nameplate franchise in your market.

    • ​
    New & Used Vehicle Finance/Lease Market Report – comparison report showing lender activity
    and buy rates in your market.

    • ​
    Used Vehicle Booking Tool – Manage your used vehicle inventory. Enter a VIN and the report will
    “rank†a vehicle by ROI against all models in the market, present recent sales and display recent
    trade in ACVs for this vehicle.

    • ​
    Used Vehicle Guidebook (Pricing Report) – details on sales of used vehicles in your market,
    including average price, cost (including reconditioning), profit, days-to-turn and other performance

    measures.

    There is a lot of good information above, however I find myself reluctant to give in to this and give up our data because I dont want to feel as if we are whoring our information, there seems to much of that already in our industry!

    Has anyone else using Firstlook read over the agreements that is with these two vendors polling their data? If so, what did you decide, are you allowing them to poll and capture all this data? It seems they are getting a whole lot of out of us, but what are we really getting in return?

    Eley
     
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  3. Alex Snyder

    Alex Snyder
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    Ohhhhhhhh Eley - you sure hit on a touchy subject. I'm not going to comment on FirstLook and what their data needs may be; I'm just going to stick to how valuable your data is in general.

    The touchy subject: YOUR DATA

    Everyone wants your data today. Your data makes them more valuable. The question is: are they returning enough value back to you to compensate you for that juicy data you're giving them?

    That statement doesn't mean you should start charging your vendors. They're still providing a service to you that answers one of your needs. Companies like Zag with TrueCar is an extreme example of one who, in my opinion, is not providing value on the data you're giving them. They're providing value in other ways, but is there a need for them to provide that same valuable service with all the data they're pulling from you? This will be a haunting question for all dealers and OEMs going forward.

    I commend you for asking this question :thumbup:

    P.S. this is a DealerRefresh article I've been wanting to write for some time.
     
  4. joe.pistell

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    When we hang the capitalists they will sell us the rope we use.
    Joseph Stalin


    Eley, we capitalists are the most efficient warriors on the planet, but, we get hungry and can miss that we're digging our own grave.

    Look at our pals in the Airline Biz: http://forum.dealerrefresh.com/f40/who-making-all-profits-1778.html#post14201
    "In this new digital age, who are the players that make all the juice? We have the factories (GM,Ford, Nissan, etc), the "Product Selection" web sites (Cars & AUtoTrader) and then the Dealer base that sell and deliver.

    Who is making all the profits?"



    Read that post. The airlines are now a servant to the Internet resellers.

    Where is the NADA leadership???
    NADA leaders, take your shovels our of your hands and gather your flock together! It's time to circle the wagons, the END IS NEAR.

    You've been warned.
     
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    #3 joe.pistell, May 12, 2011
    Last edited: May 12, 2011
  5. Jeff Kershner

    Jeff Kershner
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    Ohhh - please don't get me started in on this subject... please. Edmunds wants to do the same.
     
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  6. Alex Snyder

    Alex Snyder
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    Jeff - it is time for a joint article. Maybe we should invite a bevy of authors for this one.
     
  7. Jeff Kershner

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    My thoughts exactly!
     
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  8. CliffC

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    Elay,

    You should have control over exactly what is being transferred and should transfer only what they need to provide their service to you. Do these contracts limit their use of your data only to the services they are providing to you?

    There is no reason why they couldn't provide a list of what they are getting and on what schedule they are getting it. You must also approve any changes to the element list before they take place. This cannot possibly be too much to ask. It's your neck when it comes to private information about your customers.

    Your concern over the amount of data leaving your dealership is certainly warranted. When Tom, Dick and Harry are armed with "average selling prices" for what you and your competition have to offer, that average usually drops like a rock.

    Cliff
     
  9. Eley Duke

    Eley Duke
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    Thanks Alex, you know me, I have no problem asking questions! And it shouldn’t be touchy, it’s OUR data, and we can choose to share it or not, and no one should feel like they have to share it, I know you agree. Unfortunately too much sharing of data has landed us where we are today with our business. If it weren’t for dealers and their data, there would be no JD Powers or Edmunds. I think they all forget that, I know all too well one company that has never recognized that and they thumb their nose at their dealers and dealers continue to sign their contracts that rape us with their egos! They are still holding our data captive after 3 years and will not let us have it, they should be called “Bend Over & Bend Over” instead! Whoa Eley, ADD kicking in here. Ok, back on topic….

    Response from our Firstlook rep;
    "You can decide not to use, the limitation is that you won't be able to know what others dealers in your market are actually closing sales at. Also you won't be able to use JD powers and Edmonds as a positive reference in Max Ad, example. Our price is $850.00 below JD powers or Priced below reminds suggested price. This information is held as confident data."

    Ok, so what! Currently I don't know exactly what other dealers are closing their sales at, but according to GM reports we are doing very good with our new vehicle grosses, and we hit all the NADA profiles!

    Currently we're not writing content for our vehicles (yes I know, I should be beaten, but being dyslexic and ADD, I think it would be a bad idea for me to write content), yet with Max Ads we will be, why I signed up for it. And I really like that product a lot!

    Using Firstlook as an inventory tool, currently we have none, is my main concern and goal. Knowing how other dealers are closing their deals isn’t helping our bottom line, and each deal is different; I get enough info from GM to know where we stand compared to our like competition. As for the content, like I said, I don’t do it now, so even if I can’t say “Our price is $850 below JD Powers” I am still better off with the content we will have with Max Ads than what I have now.

    Then there is that whole other issue as everyone has said about OUR data. I am sorry I got off on that tangent above, but I am not whoring my data for Edmunds, J.D. Powers or anyone else to get rich off of and give me squat in return! If we do, the first time someone walks in the door ans says "well Edmunds says I shouldnt pay more than this for it" I would go in the back room and beat myself!

    Alex and Uncle Joe, you both hit the nail on the head, dealers are giving up this data for everyone else’s benefit, and then they wonder why and where the hell all the profits have gone. Uncle Joe, I am circling my wagon with you on this one!

    Jeff and Alex, looking forward to the article!

    PS, Alex, girls on Chick’s Beach Sunday,………. in bikini’s!
     
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  10. colson

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    I wanted to comment on this after hearing a True Car ad on the radio today, and I started thinking about what Edmunds was trying to pull out of us prior to us cancelling them in all 6 of our stores.

    The old car dogs out there lament how we as an industry have gifted our vendors the keys to the palace. The fact so much information is out there has forced us to adjust how we sell cars today. It could be argued we get what we deserve for so many years where the control swung the other way, but now we have the opportunity to take control back from the vendors who wish to extract their monthly FEE from us as a service, and using our own data to beat us over the head.

    RANT ALERT: BTW, I'm sick and tired of vendors charging me a fee for service without having their own skin in the game with me. Sell me a marketing piece, and charge me on what you return. Edmunds wanted $1795 for one of my Nissan stores, and then sent me 12 leads that first month, two of which were dupes.

    Edmunds.com argues they'll be able to give our customers more accurate information. The problem with TrueCar and other "market" pricing tools is that the customer buying today only feels like he's getting a good deal if he pays less than the "market" average. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out where this ends up.

    Obviously, I can't speak for everyone, but I can tell you I will never give a marketing partner access to this data.
     
  11. Jeff Kershner

    Jeff Kershner
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    Thanks for joining in the conversation Chris. I'm in the middle of an article for the blog that will shed some additional light in this subject.

    Be sure to read this thread if you have not already.. http://forum.dealerrefresh.com/f40/truecar-using-zag-dealer-data-create-value-743.html

    ALSO - ALERT: If your dealership is working close with CapitalOne and you signed up for these new local market analysis reports they're peddling, you too signed a contract to have your transactional data scrubbed by TrueCar!

    And my CapitalOne rep swore up and down they had NO affiliation with TrueCar...

    2011-06-14_0134.jpg
     
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