Should I kill Cars.com and use that money to enhance our AutoTrader package?

[Joe Pistell]

re: AT vs. Cars.com

WHERE ARE YOUR COMPETITORS?
#1). Look at your Inventory, get a profile.
......Does Mngt. have "favorite" used units?
............(i.e. 30% of units in 3 models)
......Who are your major Competitors? (list top 5)
......Are they on AT?
......Are they on Cars.com?
............(can you spot any leverage by being on one or the other?)

HOW WILL YOU GET YOUR UNITS SEEN?
#2). Are you the 800lb. gorilla, or the sniper?
......Gorilla = >500 used units
......Snipers have small #units and gain leverage by under cutting the Gorilla's by a few $hundred to "pop out" of classified searchs. If you're a Sniper, will mngt allow you to "snipe" as needed?

G'Luck,
Joe
p.s. Jeff, is there a way to turn on HTML for our replies?

 

[Joe Pistell]

Paul,
1st things 1st... Lets talk about YOU.

From one Experienced Internet Marketer to another, Here's my $0.02.
Remember that 'ol Billy Joel Song, The Piano Man? The customer says "...man what are you doing here?". Take a step back and look at your game plan. It's brilliant! I know it's brilliant because it's what I do for a living! hahahaha!

Really... You're bringing dom perion Champagne to a trailer park and hoping they'll all apreciate what you've brought. IMO, either you find a Dealer Group (repeat: Dealer Group) that "gets it", or, you make a go of it on your own! Case in point. I have a huge amount of respect for the fine mind of Alex Snyder. He's got his A game goin' on. BUT... the last thing Alex would want is a "player" like you in his territory. This is a compliment to you and to Alex.

Oh, and there's more!

Paul,
Allow me to take you 2-3-4 years down the road. I've just spent 3.5years building the finest most SEO friendly Chevrolet dealer site anywhere (my back hurts from me patting it so much . I dominated Natural SERPs for every city for chevrolet,model,city within a 200 mile radius. A summary of the sites accomplishments is here: http://www.dealerclearanceservices.com/breseechevrolet_com_3_0.htm .

Any how... sales got tight and the principal switched to cobalt 15 days ago and released me from my post. He didn't fully understand how deeply rooted our site was. Inside sourses tell me that call counts are down over 50% in the last 2weeks. All I am trying to say is that you're bringing an Internet Game Plan to a Dealer Principal that lives in a spreadsheet, tied to a 30 day window.

You need to think about this.
There is a lot of effort to build all this link love. Should you find a better opportunity, or, should the Dealer Principal want to have his nephew take over your position, your efforts will be passed on and your back on the street. We both know it'll take 6-12 months of heavy lifting to get momemtum going.

Idea:
If you're going to stay with this store, why not build everything to point to you? SuperSalesGuyPaul.com

Summary:
PROTECT YOURSELF.

Joe

 

[Paul Rushing]

Idea:
If you're going to stay with this store, why not build everything to point to you? SuperSalesGuyPaul.com

--------------------------------------------------------------------------
The blog networks and custom work is owned by me. I am branding myself first and the dealership second in my efforts other than the company sites. I own the domains and hosting.

Link Love can be changed at the drop of a hat or be offered as an inclusion for $$. With no one but me to dictate how it is shared or taken away.

Building link love with white hat content to push to the dealer site or personal site will pay off in spades, but as someone with almost 20 years in high ticket retail I know better than to allow that work to escape me if I leave my current situation.

Very valid point though that most would not see.

Thanks,
Paul

 

[Rex Boyd]

Daily I speak with dealers around our country on the pros and cons of each lead provider. The only thing that is ever for certain is that different lead providers are the best in the biz for different regions. My experience is that it isn't as simple as "the Mason-Dixon line". Rather, it depends on the exact location of your dealership. Therefore, the true answer is to have a tool that measures the ROI for each lead provider. This same tool should also let you know if the people in your area shop XYZ Lead Provider first and then ABC Lead Provider Second. In other words, if ABC leads are always coming in second, why subscribe?

Without outing our customers, I can share that two dealerships mentioned here for their successes use our lead management tools. iMagicLab recently launched iLeadTools.com for as little as $56 per month. Paul, if you decide to hang in there and show the dealership the value of Internet Leads, a tool like iLeadTools is so cheap that it would be silly to not incorporate it.

 

[J.D. Rucker]

Commenting in reverse order to each response for this exceptional thread:

Rex - My customers generally love your products! I'd love a post about them on my site if you get time.

Paul - Sounds like you do what I do, but I'm just further west and do it for multiple dealers.

Joe - You're 150% correct. I still try to encourage dealers to try to be the gorilla with the sniper rifle whenever possible, but 95 out of 100 are too big on bulk sales to snipe their cars off the lot.

David - My previous job was ISM in OKC. If service were everything, we would have dropped AT and went Cars.com all the way. Jojo is actually on my recruiting list (sorry if we steal him) because he blew the AT reps out of the water (except one occasion during the holidays when he brought a tin of cookies the same day that the AT rep catered lunch). Sadly, at least in OKC, AT and Cars.com are both a necessity.

Randy - Your point about specials and your well written post make me wish you'd post your web address. Great stuff, and SO true regarding an empty specials page.

Brandon - While your post was well intentioned, I hate to recommend bailing out so early. It is impossible to believe, but I worked for a dealership whose owner (in his 70s) had heard of Google but knew nothing about it. 22% unit increase YOY and 29% increase over previous month after they let me rebuild and optimize the website yield possibly the funniest comment I've ever heard: "I don't know how you Google, but whatever it is, keep Googling us."

Kevin - Absolutely! Track, track, adjust, track, adjust, track, track... That's the key. Oh, and making sure your specials pages are updated.

Jeff - I disagree about Reynolds, agree about PPC and dumping newspaper, and had a bad AT rep, but I also have dealers who swear by their AT reps, so it depends on the area. Atlanta, I would assume, is strong for AT for the reasons you and others mentioned.
***************************
Response to Paul's other post, detailed:

- PPC Campaigns to specific vehicle listings on our website - (I am very knowledgeable in PPC Traffic Arbitrage)
- working on a custom template script to create landing pages for individual cars in inventory to test with PPC. Template vs Company Website to see which converts better.
((Sounds like a good plan. I'd love to know how it works out))

- Working on a blog network - For Link Love to Main Sites and SERP domination for specific keywords. (Very Knowledgeable)
((We should talk. I have a very large automotive network currently))

- Hired a company to take pictures and provide data feeds for inventory.
- Craigslist ads - Targeting Low cost specialties like BMW, Mercedes etc.
((Great ideas. Make sure you keep on top of the picture quality. Craigslist is my personal favorite because of the "cost". I bought my last car through Craigslist))

- Using Web 2.0 sites like digg.com and Reddit.com to drive traffic to blogs and increase their link love.
((Again, we need to talk. My social plugs are strong. My Diggs get 20-40 if they don't go popular, which is great for getting my blogs indexed quickly and ranked well, plus Newsvine, Shadows... large list))
-------------------------------------------------------------

----------------Considering --------------------------------
- Going to pull the plug on cars.com. Leads generated via cars.com are way out of my market area, probably for reasons given by Alex
May pull the plug on Autotrader.com and use the money spent on these services for PPC advertising. PPC campaigns and natural traffic provide higher quality leads bar none.
((That scares me a bit, but if you can't get the money without pulling the plug, you can always rejoin if (a) your plans don't work, or (b) your plans work so well that you can get a bigger budget))

***************************************

Jake, Greg, and Alex: Your points are all good. After reading Paul's post, I think he has a plan that may trump the merits offered by AT and Cars.com. Perhaps not forever, but like I said, I think he may have some ideas that only someone in his unique position can pull off. Normally, I would say to stick with both. If Paul can put his plan into place, he might be able to "take a break" from the classifieds and get his site pumping out enough is sales to win a budget large enough for everything.

 

[Lao Shi]

If you are reallocating budget rather then enhance and existing 3rd party source it maybe be prudent to look at experimenting with new opportunities.

"Ebay local", not the auction side, has a nice program they have just introduced that has some very nice features that are offered free within the program, videos, multi image, audio presentations, email campaigns etc. The program itself runs about a $1000.00 a month however they offer specials and the free options add value. They have a respected brand and a number of dealers I mystery shopped to review are using the tool effectively and they are happy with the solution.

Another indication of the success of this solution is the number of dealers buying into the solution over the last 4 months. Ebay is not spending heavy to market and promote this because they do not have to. While you look at who is spending major advertising dollars (actually it's our money as we are paying the fees) to promote their product/service. How much does Craig's List spend???? How successful are they?

They are month to month and I have found the providers that are not asking you to tie yourself up in a1- 2-3 year contract are more confident their solution will satisfy the client. They are usually more cutting edge on the technology curve and intend on staying there.

Craig's List is a great option and you cannot beat the price. Your ISM will have to work a little and be creative however this is what we live for ….right?

Google Base is another option that should be looked into as this and Yahoo offers dealers a great option, priced right that will require the ISM's to be a little creative.

Overstock.com is another option. There are a number of these options, many free that are emerging and many more in the pipeline that will emerge in the next 6-12 months.

It's like a great time to be flexible and to experiment.

 

[Gerald]

Paul-

Congratulations on your new position. The question of keeping AT & Cars.com alive is up to you. The biggest variable I have with AT is how well we own the pre-owned vehicles. If they are owned right, your prices will be accordingly lower than the competition. You can also approach your New Car Director and see if he would support you by adding his new inventory to AT.

Since GM guy is old school, draw up a diagram, or better yet, a spreadsheet with Cost/lead, cost/sold, find out how far away Internet customers have bought from your store (especially if you don't advertise in the local media!) and support yourself with some info from the industry as to what closing/appt setting ratios they can expect with some time. (I have a spreadsheet available if you need)

Next, develop a 30-60-90 day action plan to lay out the short term course. Third, project your advertising budget along with expected leads, appointments and sales, approximate gross/unit and SHOW him how this will make more money, get his store in front of more customers. They have to understand this will get them at least regional exposure, possibly national if you have the right inventory. Fourth, expand everyones' thinking about Internet! Put up cards/tents/banners/decals in the customer lounges to tell them they can schedule their appointments online to save time. Ensure every bit of literature from the company has the website. Loaner cars, business cards, license plate holders, etc., etc. Anywhere you can put the website, put it there! Commit to a process to handle the leads and ensure the money is spent wisely. Last, but not least, ensure you pay attention to your website. Even a Reynolds site can be made to sing with proper attention and marketing efforts.

Don't let them tell you Cars and AT customers are the same- they are not. They buy essentially the same, but it is the information gathering that is different. Much the same argument for 3rd party leads. If everyone searched Google/Yahoo for a type of car in the key words you are using, there would not be a need for 3rd party leads.

There are also some tricks you can use to change your positioning on AT without spending the extra $$$$!

You might also convince him you might be able to MAKE money by selling some of the leads you generate.

Good luck!

 

[Paul Rushing]

Thanks to all for the input.

I am playing out the end of the month and will look at stats from this month and previous months, before I arrived, and make a recommendation on that.

My work load seems overwhelming at this point, but my goal in 90 days is have everything more streamlined. The blog network I am working on is starting to produce some results, however most leads are way out of my market area.

It is well known by now I don't like the current automotive classified platforms the 800lb gorillas have in that niche and will keep researching viable alternatives.

The most important goal is to sell cars and keep the pipeline full no matter from what source.

 

[BlogPro Automotive]

Paul,

Saw you mentioned you are doing some social marketing/bookmarking and also a blog network. That is great! Your GM won't appreciate it but if you are effective in it then he will appreciate the hightened exposure and increased business. We have a full-service blog/RSS marketing product that can drive significant traffic to your site if it is well optimized. Check us out and let me know if interested in exploring further.

-Ryan Gerardi

 

[Jeremy Beaver]

Paul,
Welcome back!! I see where your coming from with cutting off sources, I am an Internet and BDC Director for two large Dodge Dealer's in the California Bay Area. An excellent way to produce great quality leads is building Micro Sites, the top Internet Dealers in the country are doing it. Take it from Ralph who created the Courtesy Chevrolet Masterpiece. They are inexpensive to host every month and if you hire the right guy, they dont charge on a per lead basis. Craigslist is always good for 25 cars a month between my two stores as well. Any place you can produce your own leads and have brand recognition is awesome. I have worked as a consultant, a lead vendor, and running large internet departments. The key still in the end is to get quality leads that will sell. I still feel some exposure on both Autotrader.com and Cars.com is best.

Another idea is Specials, most dealers have the buttons on the website but never use them. I have many dedicated specials pages backed by a strong SEM campaign.