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Reach Local Blast..And Reseach

Apr 22, 2009
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Indie Results
I totally understand Mod's if you take this down, this is not a promotional post at all, I am really trying to understand why dealers use a company like Reach Local.

Below will be a post I put up maybe a week ago, but I am really trying to understand my target market (dealers) I used to think for a long time it was just because they could co-op the costs and maybe that is true, I could really use some feedback...and if there is someone from Reach here that would be great too.

I don't really sell PPC I am more of an SEO company and overall usability although I do fancy myself pretty good at PPC. I see a lot of trends in PPC sales that are similar to SEO, (vendorwise) it just seems no matter how many testimonials I get, how many case studies I provide, SEO is a very difficult sell. I am ok with that, I am just trying to understand dealers thought processes a little more as well as stimulate some good conversation for the forum.

(this was sparked by one of my seo clients accounts)


Why ReachLocal and Co-op PPC Offer Big Promises—And Poor Results

No matter what we’ve been told or know firsthand, cheap prices and big promises always seem to pique our interest despite the notion “if it looks to good to be true, it probably is…” So when it comes to PPC marketing, the bottom line is that cheaper isn’t better.

Let’s take for example, ReachLocal. If you aren’t already familiar with them, ReachLocal offer advertisers packages that include paid search ads from Google and Yahoo; Internet Yellow Pages listings from SuperPages.com; paid inclusion from LookSmart; and geo-targeted banner ads on the Advertising.com network. The service includes campaign set-up and management, simplified online media buying, and campaign reporting.

In a nutshell, ReachLocal specializes in PPC campaigns for just about anybody and everybody. They offer killer salesmanship and big promises for cheap costs—but that’s not without a catch. ReachLocal (and co-op PPC companies like them) also offer a host of drawbacks attached to the terms of agreement. In this blog, we’re going to outline the main reasons why you shouldn’t opt with ReachLocal or co-op-based PPC companies for your PPC efforts.

Though ReachLocal and other co-op PPC companies may have cheaper prices, it’s because they manage a huge volume of clients; therefore getting discounts from Google, Yahoo and other search engines. The major drawback to the lowered cost is that you’re opting with a company that manages thousands of clients. No doubt, software, not humans, are managing your campaign.

A PPC campaign needs to be fluid, and you need to be able to monitor and adjust the campaign on a daily basis based on what keywords are getting you conversions/leads. The problem with ReachLocal and other co-op PPC companies is they “limit client control,” which in other words means—you have no control.

The cost for ReachLocal and many other co-op PPC companies may initially seem cheap, but it quickly adds up as fees compound. Over $1000 per month for a PPC campaign that doesn’t help your PPC efforts is a lot of money to be wasted.

To get a better idea, let’s take one of our clients who has been working with a co-op based PPC company. The current situation when you Google the client’s company name is their PPC results (which they’re paying over $1000 per month) turn up 3rd in the adwords list with the entirely wrong URL address for the displayed webpage.

Know too, you’ll be hard pressed to ever find ReachLocal or a co-op PPC company that bothers to use custom landing pages.


If you’re considering using a co-op-based PPC company like ReachLocal for your PPC campaign, know that the majority of these companies don’t offer tailored services. Instead you’ll likely be getting software-fed-and-amalgamated service with results that are borderline atrocious. For the most part—the only one benefiting form the service is the co-op.


+++

I also wanted to point out that a company like reach local doesn't even follow the most basic PPC 101 techniques like custom URL's, landing pages, custom ad's and so much more...yuck...
 

Alex Snyder

President Skroob
May 1, 2006
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Alex
I totally understand Mod's if you take this down, this is not a promotional post at all, I am really trying to understand why dealers use a company like Reach Local.
I'll let it sit, but if someone else comes behind me with a different opinion you'll know it wasn't me. Besides, Jamie Adams hasn't made his way over here yet and I miss that big DGI swingin' mofo! ...speaking of that, where's Shaun Raines and Brian Hoecht :thinker:

To the casual reader, please know that Indie Results is a competitor of Reach Local - so take this posting for what its worth.
 
Apr 23, 2009
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ReachLocal
I have been at RL for a couple of years now and work w/ National Brands and Agencies (both inside and outside of automotive). I wanted to offer some insight as to some of the comments made above as several are simply not correct or are very misleading.

Why ReachLocal and Co-op PPC Offer Big Promises—And Poor Results

No matter what we’ve been told or know firsthand, cheap prices and big promises always seem to pique our interest despite the notion “if it looks to good to be true, it probably is…” So when it comes to PPC marketing, the bottom line is that cheaper isn’t better.

Let’s take for example, ReachLocal. If you aren’t already familiar with them, ReachLocal offer advertisers packages that include paid search ads from Google and Yahoo; Internet Yellow Pages listings from SuperPages.com; paid inclusion from LookSmart; and geo-targeted banner ads on the Advertising.com network. The service includes campaign set-up and management, simplified online media buying, and campaign reporting.

Response: This looks like a decent description of our publisher network.....3 or so years ago. We no longer serve ads on Superpages.com or through Advertising.com. We do have a much larger publisher network (both Search) and Display that you can find out more about by visiting our website.

In a nutshell, ReachLocal
specializes in PPC campaigns for just about anybody and everybody. They offer killer salesmanship and big promises for cheap costs—but that’s not without a catch. ReachLocal (and co-op PPC companies like them) also offer a host of drawbacks attached to the terms of agreement. In this blog, we’re going to outline the main reasons why you shouldn’t opt with ReachLocal or co-op-based PPC companies for your PPC efforts.

Response: Not sure what you mean bo "co-op PPC" company but your assumptions regarding our relationship w/ publishers are very misleading and false.

Though ReachLocal and other co-op PPC companies may have cheaper prices, it’s because they manage a huge volume of clients; therefore getting discounts from Google, Yahoo and other search engines. The major drawback to the lowered cost is that you’re opting with a company that manages thousands of clients. No doubt, software, not humans, are managing your campaign.

Response: We absolutely use our bid management technology to manage & optimize campaign budgets. This is great for our advertisers because they don't have to worry about a "human" dropping the ball on the daily management and optimization of campaign budgets. The only way to efficiently scale management of a large number of relatively small campaigns is to use an automated bid management technology. I have seen (and have been impressed w/) quite a few of these technologies, and strongly believe we have one of the best for businesses looking to advertise locally on the Internet.

I also want to point out that we have a team of very talented Campaign Management people who do make adjustments to campaigns when needed. Most of that team came from other SEM firms and even the major Search Engines themselves.

A PPC campaign needs to be fluid, and you need to be able to monitor and adjust the campaign on a daily basis based on what keywords are getting you conversions/leads. The problem with ReachLocal and other co-op PPC companies is they “limit client control,” which in other words means—you have no control.

Response: While clients don't have access to make changes to campaigns, we certainly don't "limit" client control or input. Some of our clients have had lots of experience managing an Adwords campaign - and are good at it. We have found that a large number of our advertisers (inside and outside auto) do not have the expertise to manage these campaigns on their own, nor do they necessarily want to do that. What they do want is to better understand how digital media is effecting their business, and how we can help them solve for that.

The cost for ReachLocal and many other co-op PPC companies may initially seem cheap, but it quickly adds up as fees compound. Over $1000 per month for a PPC campaign that doesn’t help your PPC efforts is a lot of money to be wasted.

Response: Again, no idea what co-op PPC company means - but nothing about this statement makes much sense to me.

Know too, you’ll be hard pressed to ever find ReachLocal or a co-op PPC company that bothers to use custom landing pages.

Response: Definitely not true. We will land traffic to any site a business wants to use to generate leads/traffic. These could include a single landing page, micro-site, or dynamic page routing to any page w/in the businesses website based on the keyword search query.

If anyone wants a true look behind the curtains behind RL's technology and digital media services, please feel free to reach out to me directly at [email protected]. Also, you can check out some recent press we have received in the WSJ at Local Web-Ad Market Cools Down - WSJ.com - and Greg Sterling's blog ReachLocal Xchange Revisited Screenwerk. Greg is the industry guru when it comes to Local Digital Media.

Jeff - honestly don't mean for this to be a "plug". As you know, I am a big reader but very rarely post regarding RL.

Thanks,

Jamie
 
Apr 22, 2009
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Indie Results
I'll let it sit, but if someone else comes behind me with a different opinion you'll know it wasn't me. Besides, Jamie Adams hasn't made his way over here yet and I miss that big DGI swingin' mofo! ...speaking of that, where's Shaun Raines and Brian Hoecht :thinker:

To the casual reader, please know that Indie Results is a competitor of Reach Local - so take this posting for what its worth.

(for the record I do not compete with them they are solely PPC, I and solely SEO) :)
 
Apr 22, 2009
24
0
0
First Name
Indie Results
I have been at RL for a couple of years now and work w/ National Brands and Agencies (both inside and outside of automotive). I wanted to offer some insight as to some of the comments made above as several are simply not correct or are very misleading.

In a nutshell, ReachLocal
specializes in PPC campaigns for just about anybody and everybody. They offer killer salesmanship and big promises for cheap costs—but that’s not without a catch. ReachLocal (and co-op PPC companies like them) also offer a host of drawbacks attached to the terms of agreement. In this blog, we’re going to outline the main reasons why you shouldn’t opt with ReachLocal or co-op-based PPC companies for your PPC efforts.

Response: Not sure what you mean bo "co-op PPC" company but your assumptions regarding our relationship w/ publishers are very misleading and false.


Jamie

I am saying companies that the OEM covers costs for the dealership...ie cobalt, reach local and others. (co-op)
 
Apr 22, 2009
24
0
0
First Name
Indie Results
Know too, you’ll be hard pressed to ever find ReachLocal or a co-op PPC company that bothers to use custom landing pages.
Response: Definitely not true. We will land traffic to any site a business wants to use to generate leads/traffic. These could include a single landing page, micro-site, or dynamic page routing to any page w/in the businesses website based on the keyword search query.

I have two seo clients that use your PPC services that you simply send the traffic to the homepage... I would be happy to send them to you directly maybe something is wrong with their accounts?
 
Apr 22, 2009
24
0
0
First Name
Indie Results
Response: While clients don't have access to make changes to campaigns, we certainly don't "limit" client control or input. Some of our clients have had lots of experience managing an Adwords campaign - and are good at it. We have found that a large number of our advertisers (inside and outside auto) do not have the expertise to manage these campaigns on their own, nor do they necessarily want to do that. What they do want is to better understand how digital media is effecting their business, and how we can help them solve for that.


question do your customers have access to the keywords you are bidding on? Can your customers write ad copy? Can your customers split test landing pages Can you customers split test ad's?
 
Apr 22, 2009
24
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0
First Name
Indie Results
Sorry for so many posts but I wanted to break up my responses. I don’t want this to be a shouting match, maybe RL has tons of happy customers, I just haven’t really come across too many of them. Here is an example of what your PPC “experts†run for clients. I don’t really want to point out a client but since you have claimed my thoughts as untrue here is a real world example


On search term “2009 vw jetta Milwaukee†the first results is one of your clients…good work so far…lets look at the ad.


Hall Volkswagen Milwaukee

Online Quotes, Inventory & Savings.
Hall Volkswagen in Milwaukee.
hallvwmilwaukee.com

This ad is terrible wouldn’t you agree? I don’t write PPC ad copy but if I did A Much Better ad would be something like:

2009 VW Jetta
Best Selection In Milwaukee
Internet Specials Special Financing
Milwaukee New & Used VW Car Dealer | Hall Volkswagen in Brookfield, WI

something like that….


Then lets look at your landing page url
Code:
http://hallmazdamilwaukee.reachlocal.com/coupon/?scid=928523&cid=327829&tc=09042313323070671&kw=863541:14348&dynamic_proxy=1&primary_serv=hallmazdamilwaukee1.reachlocal.net&se_refer=http%253A%252F%252Fwww.google.com%252Fsearch%253Fhl%253Den%2526client%253Dfirefox-a%2526channel%253Ds%2526rls%253Dorg.mozilla%25253Aen-US%25253Aofficial%2526hs%253DPt5%2526q%253D2009%252Bvw%252Bjetta%252Bmilwaukee%2526btnG%253DSearch
you have the WRONG dealership listed first of all…. And I will leave it at that


landing page:

home page

wouldn’t you agree at the very least you should be taking them to a page about Jetta’s or their Jetta inventory?

This is PPC 101…..


Now maybe this account is brand new and you are building it out, but it lacks even the most basic knowledge of PPC…
 
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