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Conquest Email Services - Exposed?

These deals are pretty much a F*#K job!

I had a vendor blowing up my phone, saying that he was going to drive all of this traffic to my site...all relevant and local of course! My traffic went through the roof, and my analytics went to shit.

It was traffic from all over the world, about half of it outside the country. There was no rhyme or reason to the session activity that I was seeing. Most all of it was desktop traffic.

These companies are paying some dumbass(s) to sit at a computer and click randomly all over our sites so that we "get our money's worth"!

There are no free rides. Best case scenario we can get a little traction marketing to the email addresses that we actually collected ourselves.

I am with @skutchhenks , it just isn't worth any effort whatsoever. It is a scam. It is a total bullshit deal.
 
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YOU GET WHAT YOU PAY FOR.
This conversation totally mirrors the analysis we have been doing over the past year.
CityTwist, Data Dynamix, BMi, Take5, LeadMe and V12 - all suck. Total waste of my time and money.
Our current program does show some real light.
About 80% of the traffic is mobile and in the right geo.
Of course there are always issues around the edges but 90% of the traffic is solid.
And we run an extensive match back to validate long term value.
Acxiom and InfoGroup are the two legit vendors we work with.
Acxiom has a deeper product offering because of the cross platform stuff with LiveRamp.
Infogroup is pretty good too.
Both are MUCH more expensive than the scammers, but you get what you pay for.
 
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@skutchhenks, A very interesting thread especially since here at AutoSweet we do Conquest Email Marketing. And by 'do', I mean we have a platform that helps a dealer report on whether a conquest campaign is working for them. How it works:
* Our team prepares the creative for you in-house and works directly with you to meet your marketing objectives
* We also work with the manufacturer brand agencies to build the creative that matches current manufacturer national programs and to get co-op dollars if possible
* We integrate with your DMS and are certified with many DMS partners to get your data securely. We've been in the DMS data aggregation business for many years and this is core to the services that AutoSweet provides
* We use DMS access for three things only:
a) confirm that the geo you want to target is a realistically where you sell, there's no sense in sending 25,000 emails to a zip code where you sell one car a year
b) gather all email addresses from your service and sales transactions to use as a suppression list against our lists -- we know that you are (or should be) marketing to your customers regularly using your CRM, so we don't want to hit them with these Conquest emails
c) as the campaign runs, we match sold transactions in both service and sales to the postal addresses we are marketing to and report on the ROI
* We then send the emails through a variety of data partners including our own affiliate database; our platform is designed to send data through multiple platforms
* We then integrate our platform to Google Analytics and report on the traffic, specifically number of sessions, bounce rates, new users %, time on site, pages viewed, etc.
* We also compile data from the data partners and report on email statistics like Opens and Clicks so that you can use that in creating a true ROI picture

We believe that our reports are the most transparent and real-time in the business and we know that you as a dealership are looking for good traffic, real users and in the end buyers. We vet new partners for consistency, quality, deliverability so that you don't have to. And we report on the matched service and sales transactions that are generated. We built this platform to help our dealerships understand their email traffic.

I'm sorry but that probably sounded like one big sales pitch. By all means call us if you want to try conquest email done right or check out our site: http://www.autosweet.com/email-marketing/email-marketing/.

I think Chad and Brian in his latest video brings up some great points and honestly I wish we had access to measure some of the things that Chad suggests, but we are limited to Google Analytics and sales & service transactional matches. Our team is going to look for some more opportunities for more transparency based on these posts and add those to future platform releases.

Lastly while the experiences described are troubling, we know that we are generating local non-bot traffic. We can produce postal lists early in the process or even prior to sending the email. We have talked to the real people we are emailing that are buying your services. Our DMS transaction ROI report is a clear indicator of real sales to touched consumers on both your sales and service sides of the house. Our customer testimonials tell compelling stories of traffic at the store, calls, leads and increase in year over year sales. Advertising isn't always about conversion on the first email, it's about branding and building awareness and often times just being top of mind when a consumer decides to start considering a purchase. We feel that conquest email should be a part of that total marketing effort because it provides direct verifiable access to the most consumers at a Killer ROI. We wouldn't be a part of it if we saw otherwise. Reputable email list vendors have real lists that they have worked hard to acquire and the good ones work hard to keep them current by removing bots, adding fresh names, updating addresses as people move and removing emails that don't interact. They also control how often they send and how the email servers see them because their reputation is everything. Make sure you are working with one that is transparent and helpful, take the time to investigate in your own Google Analytics as @brianpasch suggests or use a platform like AutoSweet that helps you monitor and track your performance.
 
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So I looked at some of my customer's Google Analytics and I also found some results that are hard to explain..The visitors are coming from local cities, so that is good, but like Brian's example, nearly all of the results were Windows desktop users. Which doesn't correspond to their normal traffic at all. Mobile is roughly half of their traffic, but for email campaigns, it's 96%. For some of their sites, the bulk of the demographic is 18-34 year olds, but 94-98% of the email traffic was from Windows desktops. That just doesn't add up. That demographic is very skewed towards mobile, not desktop.

It doesn't add up because it's not human behavior. Conquest email Analytics and site behaviors should closely resemble your email campaigns to current customers within your database. Not the open and click rates of the email, but the pageviews, mobile %, demographics, time on site, etc should all be comparable.

Your visitor's location can't be determined by looking at Analytics, it's too easy to trick or confuse Analytics on visitor location. You have to look at IPs within your website server's access logs, then take those IPs and do a whois lookup. Look back at my post on page 1. When I was at Anderson Auto Group and did a Take 5/Dealers United email campaign, a majority of visitors from appeared in Analytics as from Lincoln, NE. However, looking at the access logs the visits came from a single IP range of 191.101.40.xxx to 191.101.43.xxx) It turned up to be a proxy server located in our city.
 
Your visitor's location can't be determined by looking at Analytics, it's too easy to trick or confuse Analytics on visitor location. You have to look at IPs within your website server's access logs, then take those IPs and do a whois lookup. Look back at my post on page 1. When I was at Anderson Auto Group and did a Take 5/Dealers United email campaign, a majority of visitors from appeared in Analytics as from Lincoln, NE. However, looking at the access logs the visits came from a single IP range of 191.101.40.xxx to 191.101.43.xxx) It turned up to be a proxy server located in our city.

This is just as easy to fake though. Plenty of IPs have an incorrect location or are not accurate.
This may get you the right city, but I've seen plenty of times where it doesn't.
My own IP says it's coming from a city 2 hours away.
This is also true for almost all cellular IPs - mine shows as coming from where my carrier's main office is.

Accurate location targeting without the user consenting to share their location is quite difficult. That said, IPs or Analytics should both give a decent insight into it - I can't imagine more than 10% of your visitors are browsing the internet with some sort of location tricking.
 
This is just as easy to fake though. Plenty of IPs have an incorrect location or are not accurate.
This may get you the right city, but I've seen plenty of times where it doesn't.
My own IP says it's coming from a city 2 hours away.
This is also true for almost all cellular IPs - mine shows as coming from where my carrier's main office is.

Accurate location targeting without the user consenting to share their location is quite difficult. That said, IPs or Analytics should both give a decent insight into it - I can't imagine more than 10% of your visitors are browsing the internet with some sort of location tricking.

True, I should expanded and/or explained a little better. If looking at access IPs, you must be familiar with the local ISPs and wireless carriers. Example, one dealer site I run a majority of their Analytics and IPs are coming from Minnesota, but they're based in Nebraska. The main ISP in that city is headquartered in Minnesota.


The logged IPs from the email blast I was looking at were a single range and almost consecutive. Normal IPs on same ISP will have a broader range.
 
True, I should expanded and/or explained a little better. If looking at access IPs, you must be familiar with the local ISPs and wireless carriers. Example, one dealer site I run a majority of their Analytics and IPs are coming from Minnesota, but they're based in Nebraska. The main ISP in that city is headquartered in Minnesota.


The logged IPs from the email blast I was looking at were a single range and almost consecutive. Normal IPs on same ISP will have a broader range.

@csabatka1 , if it is any consolation, I understood exactly what you meant.

I have been down this road 3 times now, and I am just done with it. I understand exactly the type of site behavior you are talking about, and I understand your point about all of the IP's falling within a pretty tight range.

As you said, the traffic is not real.

Your fact finding is excellent. I don't have the ability to back up my findings with data the way that you do.

Job well done.
 
YOU GET WHAT YOU PAY FOR.
This conversation totally mirrors the analysis we have been doing over the past year.
CityTwist, Data Dynamix, BMi, Take5, LeadMe and V12 - all suck. Total waste of my time and money.
Our current program does show some real light.
About 80% of the traffic is mobile and in the right geo.
Of course there are always issues around the edges but 90% of the traffic is solid.
And we run an extensive match back to validate long term value.
Acxiom and InfoGroup are the two legit vendors we work with.
Acxiom has a deeper product offering because of the cross platform stuff with LiveRamp.
Infogroup is pretty good too.
Both are MUCH more expensive than the scammers, but you get what you pay for.

John, I work with Bridge Marketing a leading email data and deployment company. We supply email conquest programs to many top auto dealers and their agencies. We have a fully transparent process which includes targeted data, email platform, digital display, reporting and matchback files. Would like to discuss how we can help you deploy your email campaigns. Let me know a good time to connect. Bob Emond.