Lightnup,
I wasn't the one who wrote you up, you might want to send some hostility and anger towards them not me. It's sad you're leaving us, Goodbye.

Okay, this will be my last post to this thread, because it's embarrassing that it keeps getting bumped to the top because of a malignant cancer like TTT, who truly is not worth the time it takes to reply.

No matter what company it is, whether it's ATC or any of your dealerships whose employees post here, to have an employee who publicly demeans, ridicules and undermines the company's management, products and reputation while gleefully taking a paycheck from them is absolutely disgusting and the perfect example of the term lowlife.

Not every decision made by ATC management has been the right one (clearly evidenced by the hiring of someone like TTT). And I have no problems with Alex or David's recent posts which are based on what did or didn't work for them. But TTT intentionally discouraging potential customers from considering her own company's products is a slap in the face to the people she walks through the front door with every morning and to those of us who are out here sincerely interested in helping our dealers maximize their online results through our solutions.

TTT, you apparently think you know who I am but you have no clue. Instead of giving that any more thought, you should be spending your time updating your resume, lying to your next employer about being a valued, loyal employee. What a joke. Only wish I could be there when you are eventually escorted off company property.

That's it. I'm done. Sorry for this thread being bumped to the top one last time by me. It will not happen again.

Lightnup, how could my sources be wrong if they sit 20 feet away from you! But in any event, it's okay, you can continue playing macho man in this forum... it's amusing!

Alex and Frank, ATC works, it might not have worked for your store but overall it works, what I’m talking about here is the used car classifieds section.

The New vehicle components are a joke, the credit center is useless, the bulk of visitors will continue searching for vehicles the old fashion way.
Autotrader's viewership has increased but due to the rerouting and refuneling of these visitors the average used car dealer is receiving less and less activity year after year.
If it wasn't for the "All" radio button, when searching for a car, new car clicks would be non-existent. The idea there is to have consumers look at new car advertising whether they like it or not!

Right on Frank! This is exactly what I did a long time ago. In fact, we were so shocked with how poor the ROI was, we had our ATC rep bring in 2 years worth of reports and worked backwards. Just to give you an idea of how bad it was: two weeks after we were done our ATC rep quit to come sell cars for us - lol. This was back in 2005.

When this article was started (November of 2007) I was in the tail-end of a 3 month trial with ATC. At the time, we had two new GM's who swore we had to be there, so we gave it another shot. We're not paying for AutoTrader.com anymore. We have our Toyota store on because it is free through the Toyota regional ad agency. Because of this account I still get visits and calls from ATC. I have to say, our two newest ATC reps are incredibly nice and accommodating. At the end of the day it isn't the reps who make a ROI - it is the product, and it needs to change.

Wow you two are really in some kind of pissing match, if it was not for this post I am not sure what you two would do?

Anyway my thoughts regarding Autotrader.com. I like many others thought you needed Auto trader; I have to admit it is nice to afford the luxury of having them if you have money to burn. I checked my ROI for two years and what I spent with AT, Found it did not seem like a very good business decision to keep them. I have heard all the arguments from the reps as I have had three come by to try and get me to resign. Since leaving auto trader I have taken those dollars and used them to create more relevant traffic for my store. Some think I am crazy for not using them but AT is not our only source for web traffic. If you take a real serious look at what AT brings to the table you might also decide to move on without them.

If you stand back and take a real serious look at AT you will see that we pay to have our vehicles posted on Autotrader.com. On each search page there are banners everywhere doing everything but directing eyes to your vehicles, When eyes do land on your page what do they see? Your vehicle right, but what other advertising is on that page that you paid for? I believe if I paid for that page it should be mine, for my vehicle, my web address, my credit link. No other banners at all, no other links, no other credit advertisements period. Auto trader has it made because for every vehicle on the site that is another number, for every number there is revenue. I think it is great they make money and that is my goal also, but I am not spending my budget with someone who lets others advertise on my pages.(I just pulled up a at page and counted 14 links for other advertisers) WOW!!! How much revenue do the recieve from each and every page, might be they should pay the dealers so they have pages for everyone else to advertise on. When they stop that practice then they will have earned my business back, but they will have to cut the cost by more than half. It seems they think Dealerships cannot do business without them, I assure you that you can increase your business without them.

Just my opinion

ATC should've pushed into the new car sector SERIOUISLY three years ago. Now playing "catch up" in deciding to promote new car sector in the midst of the worst recession in 30 yrs. Is it a good idea ?, yes, will it be effective? no, it's tantamount to pi$$ing into the wind.

Autotrader is like a second grader who keeps raising their hand but doesn't know the answer when called upon. Ready, Fire, Aim.

TTT provided this myopic, cockeyed marketing analysis: "The hundreds of millions they are about to spend on this [new car] campaign is a terrible waste of money and couldn't come in a worst time. New car business is horrible right now. This money is better spent modernizing the website and optimizing the search quality."

TTT, the company that provides your paycheck is launching a huge consumer-centric advertising campaign aimed at driving more shoppers to dealers' new car inventories at the very time when new car business is horrible. And you have a problem with that? Perhaps you'd rather wait until new car sales are at record highs and THEN offer to help our dealers sell more new cars...when they don't need the help? I hope you don't aspire to management or we're all in trouble.(And SOS is right, ATC's new car traffic has always been much smaller than used car traffic...that's why they are launching a new car campaign. DUH.)

TTT also wrote: "I heard lighten up got written up!"

Didn't happen. Your sources suck. Instead of chasing rumors, take a marketing class. Your employer, whom you enjoy dissing so much, will probably even pay for it....unless they discover who you are first.

Frank, the sad fact is that their attitude is so cavalier that they will actually expect you to come beggin back to them within a 3 to 6 month period. Some dealers would in the past and come to a compromise on pricing but so many dealers are tired of the game that they've written off autotrader and have found pastures just as green for less ad spend elsewhere. The 800lb gorilla has been on a diet the past year and is now down to about 250 lbs.

Looks like might have been a good idea to cancel autotrader

They've come to market way late in trying to capture revenue from dealers on new car advertising. Between the manuf's initiatives with display advertising on search engines and many other successful venues dealers have been utilizing, ATC has been asleep at the wheel and missed the boat on this one almost entirely. If dealers only knew how very small in comparison ATC's new car searches are in relation to used car searches would they be extremely skeptical on spending precious ad dollars going after new car customers with Autotrader.com. I'm sure they're too busy patting each other on the back in Atlanta to even realize this or even admit it. Purple mustaches from all the kool-aid I guess.

The hundreds of millions they are about to spend on this campaign is a terrible waste of money and couldn't come in a worst time. New car business is horrible right now. This money is better spent modernizing the website and optimizing the search quality.

If it involves ATC you know there's drama! Welcome back from vaca. just in time for the New Car Partnership Kool-Aid drinking contest!

Back from vacation....it felt good to be away from all this drama!
So, what's happening? I heard lighten up got written up !

ATC Corp would love to ping ISP's of this thread and immed fire all involved. Notice how many folks posted w/serious arguements in their defense this entire thread? Has to be a good reason for that one don't you think? I'd personally like to hear them seriously address the obvious lack of ROI in the past two years but the silence is deafening from their corp front lines.

Well said Alex! But I think if Corp. had a prayer of stopping the rolling freight train that has been this thread they would have tried to do it after you posted it in November of last year!

To clarify why this thread was started: it is not about singing Kumbaya again - it is about a decreasing ROI. If some AutoTrader.com employees have their own opinions of things, then that is an internal ATC problem.

This thread is definitely out of control when reading it from an AutoTrader.com perspective. If this was about my company, I'd have had multiple heart attacks by now.

AutoTrader.com Corporate - if you're listening (and I know you are), please take a look at the Dealer Refresh article about Husker BMW - there is a lesson to be learned about listening and acting there.

"...and the Lightnups who I'm guessing (since he/she hasn't ever stated what they do for ATC) never go into the field to meet with dealers and here (sic) their concerns face to face..."

Every day, all day long, that's what I do...meet with dealers face to face and hear their concerns. Take cancellations, sell new dealers, take downgrades, upgrade dealers, re-sign canceled dealers. Work with my happy dealers, work with my unhappy dealers. Do my best to assist all of them in getting the most out of their online presence.

What I don't do is focus on how ATC used to do this, used to do that, used to pay their salespeople like this, used to be priced like that, used to give out better free stuff, used to have group hugs and used to sing Kumbaya around the ATC campfire.

Yeah well, gas used to be $1.09 a gallon, city traffic didn't used to be so bad, the margins on new cars used to be higher and people didn't used to be able to go online to get factory invoice. So what? You either deal with it or you make yourself miserable by focusing on how unfair it is, wishing it was the way it used to be and, like TTT, spread your miserableness by ridiculing and criticizing your employer in public forums. I know which method works for me.

Just as I posted last night - more competition - If ATC was a public company I would be shorting the stock at this point --

Here is a new alternative similar to the "indeed.com, and simplyhired.com" in the job board market...

Jeff--- you might want to contact them to give your readers some more insight?..

iSeeCars.com -- A Powerful Web2.0 Search Engine for Used Car Deals

Download this press release as an Adobe PDF document.

Team from Harvard, IIT, Peking University, Princeton Launches a Revolutionary New Way to Search for Used Cars Online

Boston, MA (PRWEB) April 24, 2008 -- An experienced team of PhDs, software engineers, and former entrepreneurs, hailing from top universities throughout the world such as Harvard, Indian Institute of Technology (IIT), Peking University, and Princeton, has launched the public beta version of iSeeCars.com after having it in alpha for several months for testing and user feedback. iSeeCars.com is a revolutionary new Web2.0 search engine for used cars that gives consumers a powerful way to search for cars for sale across the Web and to discover and find the right car at the right price more easily, quickly and smartly. iSeeCars.com automates many of the manual, time-consuming steps that a consumer typically goes through today in the online search process.

iSeeCars Used Car Search Engine
iSeeCars Used Car Search Engine

iSeeCars is REALLY useful! The search functionality is a huge leap forward than what exists today, and the scroll-over data analysis tool is a really nice feature. I am impressed!! It reminded me a little of how kayak.com has really improved on flight searching (over Orbitz, Travelocity, Expedia, etc.).
"With just one click, users of iSeeCars.com will be able to see used car listings from thousands of websites such as car classifieds sites like Craigslist, Cars.com, and Google; newspaper sites like New York Times and Boston Globe; and auction sites like eBay along with many local dealership websites," said Jim Lee, a Co-Founder. "Think of iSeeCars.com as the Google for car classifieds. We conceived of and developed iSeeCars.com as a result of our personal frustrations with our own experiences in having to go through the tedious effort of performing multiple searches on multiple websites such as Craigslist, Cars.com, Autotrader and in having to spend an enormous amount of time manually combing through the car classified listings looking for the right car deal."

Not only does iSeeCars.com provide a simple one-click search, but it also gives consumers relevant, insightful guidance, tools, and information to more easily and quickly discover a potential car deal through its innovative, proprietary ACAR (Automated Car Analysis and Ranking) technology. For example, when a consumer performs a cars for sale search on iSeeCars.com, the search results of car listings are automatically and impartially sorted based on the extent to which the car may be a "potential deal," with the car listings displayed at the top more likely to be a potential deal than the ones towards the bottom. Thus, automating for consumers what they would have to do manually today to find a car deal, saving them much time, effort and frustration. iSeeCars.com's technology algorithmically determines the extent to which the car is a "potential deal" based on a number of factors such as:

* how the asking price compares with the market
* whether the car has a clean car history
* whether the seller has maintenance records/receipts
* whether the car still has a warranty
* whether the seller is moving, in which case the seller maybe more willing to negotiate
* whether the car is a non-smoker's car
* whether the seller is the original or second owner of the car
* whether the car has had new or replaced parts like tires, brakes, etc

Another way iSeeCars.com is transforming the way consumers look for used cars is by providing "Listing Insight" for each car classified ad summarizing the key features and selling points depicted in the seller's listing description about the car's condition (how well has the car been maintained, was it garaged, etc), history (has it been in an accident), ownership, warranty, negotiability, among other things. The functionality effectively lets users preview the listing in an easily comprehensible manner in order to more quickly determine which listing maybe worthwhile learning more and contacting the seller about. Often times, the seller's descriptions are presented in an unstructured way and can take some time for a consumer to read through it and understand the key points made. iSeeCars.com's unique technology automates this step by analyzing each car classified description, detecting the key selling points, and presenting them in a standard, structured summary.

When a consumer discovers a car that is of interest, the consumer may also desire to find out if there are similar cars for sale that maybe a better deal. iSeeCars.com's one of a kind "Compare Prices with Similar Cars" tool allows users to graphically see the prices of other cars of the same make, model, year and within a similar mileage range. "If there are similar cars with a lower price, it's a great tool for the consumer to easily look up those car listings in case there might be a better car for a better deal," added Lee.

"Since the launch of the alpha version several months ago, we have received very positive feedback from consumers." One consumer from Boston commented, "iSeeCars is REALLY useful! The search functionality is a huge leap forward than what exists today, and the scroll-over data analysis tool is a really nice feature. I am impressed!! It reminded me a little of how kayak.com has really improved on flight searching (over Orbitz, Travelocity, Expedia, etc.)." Another user emailed us saying, "The Listing Insight is an excellent feature...the Price comparison tool is awesome for price-sensitive people like me to look for good deals."

The functionalities described are just some of the many on iSeeCars.com. "We will continue to add more helpful features and tools, search more websites beyond the thousands of sites we currently crawl, and launch the service in more and more cities," said Lee. The best feature of all is that iSeeCars.com is free for consumers to use.

Currently, the iSeeCars.com service is available for searching for used cars in the following city metros: used cars Boston, used cars New York, used cars San Francisco, used cars Los Angeles, used cars Philadelphia, used cars Dallas, used cars Houston, used cars Phoenix, used cars Seattle, and used cars Atlanta.

"I have to agree with TTT - ATC has screwed up over the last 12 months to compensate for increased cancellations and after one of their top leaders that treated "ATC employees like first class citizens" retired it all went down hill from there"

So true. What they're left with is a bunch of "Yes Men" in senior management. I'm actually trying to come up with a sector of people in which they've dealt with that they haven't manage to totally piss off, dealers, sales people, inside production staff, etc.

I have to agree with TTT - ATC has screwed up over the last 12 months to compensate for increased cancellations and after one of their top leaders that treated "ATC employees like first class citizens" retired it all went down hill from there.

Regardless, this posting is about Pricing - it all comes down to ROI and dealers weren't receiving it as they did years ago, (more competition SEM/SEO, Lead providers, free sites that get value Craigslist/Web2Cars ) are going to keep making it tougher for ATC. Also, with there own sale people not getting compensated the way they use to there are going to be more cancellations, less service, and more TTTs internally and stay until they find a better opportunity, and the Lightnups who I'm guessing (since he/she hasn't ever stated what they do for ATC) never go into the field to meet with dealers and here their concerns face to face will continue to not listen to their internal customers (employees) and external customers and think they are the 800 lb gorilla that can just auto renew everyone at any time and think there are no other alternatives for dealers -- which again is not true and it will continue be more competitive.

If Google opened up all inventory to be searchable or came up with a Google Autos or Google Motors division it would be game over for ATC and others.

So how will ATC try to keep up with there growth/revs/profitability? Continue to do what they have done the last 12 months and - cut costs/compensation plans and keep raising rates that do not equal the value the dealer gets in return.

Do this and there will be more problems - fix it by stop adding more reps to markets keep the top 4-5 reps per market pay them better and give incentives to "Service" the book of business give dealers more options and price levels (ipod model)

just my 2 cents..

TTT wrote: "Lightnup wants to turn things around, make me look like a bad girl hoping that would score him points with his puppeteers. I am expressing my point of view, some might consider that brave others disloyal, obviously the AT robots and brown noses think of me as the latter."

TTT,

1. If I had even the slightest desire to "score points," why would I post anonymously? DUH. What good does scoring points do me if no one even knows who I am? I don't care about scoring points any more than I care what your co-worker thinks of me. I, like you, am just expressing my opinion, like it or not.

2. If, as you say, you are convinced that management is made up of "puppeteers," and those who don't share your negative attitude are "robots" and "brown-noses," then how do you get out of bed every morning and report to work? If you owned a company, would you want you to work for you? I highly doubt it.

Please, for your own mental health and the potential safety of your co-workers (hopefully you're not a gun owner), exhibit some real bravery by finding a job somewhere else.

Despite your undoubtedly valuable contribution to the company (with your attitude I'm sure you're just a shining example of productivity), I suspect that AutoTrader.com will manage to carry on after you are gone.

WOW! There is a lot to catch-up on after a few days at the Digital Dealer Conference.....and I don't know what else to say other than WOW!

Brian,

A coworker emailed me a link. She's also pissed at lightnup for being such a dork.

Wow does Lightnup need to Lightnup?
sorry couldn't resist

TTT,
just curious.....How did you happen to stumble upon this site?

Integrity: adherence to moral and ethical principles; soundness of moral character; honesty. If you only knew how some autotrader sales people have been treated would you be laughing at the word integrity. Saying one thing and doing another are in fact two very different things.