I was on this morning for a while, but getting an error message now...

Is anyone having problems accessing the CARS invoice web site this morning? I have not been able to get on to check the status of my invoices this morn...

My advice is to certainly sit-tight. Like you said -- you both have the same goal. There are now 2000 people going through the applications -- should start to pick-up. On another note... I've seen a couple of mentions now regarding the "Salvage Value." Consumers need to understand that absolutely nowhere, anywhere, is it written or stated that the consumer is to be refunded any salvage value over the $50 alloted for "administrative" funds. This has been discussed in depth during NHTSA/NADA webinars on the CARS program. The rules do say the dealer is allowed to keep $50 for administrative costs, but again NOWHERE state that the consumer should be given the difference. Some dealers may choose to refund the difference, some may not, opining that there are costs incurred other than "administrative" in nature. Perhaps NHTSA will clarify at a later date, but it is factually erroneous for consumers to expect to receive salvage value in excess of $50 "by law." At best, the rules are enormously vague.

So here's the million dollar question:

Should consumers push the dealers to release a car bought with the CARS program or should we sit tight and continue to wait for the approval from the government?

We submitted our application on July 27th. Our dealer put it into the system that night. "Our" new car and clunker have been sitting on the dealer's lot since then. We really want our new car and I'm sure the dealer really wants us to take it (and stop calling them). It seems as though the dealer is breaking the law by making us wait for the approval on our clunker. (Silly law really..... why should the dealer have to take a financial risk on our clunker deal?)

Should I call the NHTSA and VW of America to report them? Should I wait to call them until after we get the car? Should I sit tight and do nothing?

The dealer also listed the salvage value of our clunker as $50, so he said we won’t get anything from that. Our clunker is a ’92 GMC Yukon. Where can I find the actual salvage value?

I seems this program has really become a mess. I am curious, to the dealers out there - if this program were to be offered again, would you participate or avoid all together? Is all of this mess worth the extra sales? In other words, has the "gift horse" that government has handed out to you too (I assume Net Sales for most dealerships benifited greatly, although I do not have any data to back that up at my fingertips), to the dealers become a "white elephant"? As for me, the dealership and I are coming to a mutually acceptable outcome so, please, do not take my above question in the context that I might have some "ax to grind".

Thank you - Chris

Bravo to Mr. Quinn!!!!!!!

I'm sorry, but they are not playing by the rules anyway you look at it. If they were becoming concerned about not being able to front the $$ for following the rules (allowing customers to accept delivery), then they should have stopped accepting new applicants until it could be fronted, or dropped the clunker program altogether like other dealerships have. However, they chose to bend the rules in order to take advantage of the increased number of sales they would receive by continuing to participate.

Steve, to be honest, your sense of "entitlement" here is a bit disturbing. You want to look a gift-horse in the mouth, well then I guess you're enitled. Good luck!

True, but likewise many of us are still driving these "clunkers" that should already be on the dealer lot. We are guzzling gas left and right, and many of us (like myself) are driving clunkers that need/could use repair. If we are told we have the right to be in possession of our new vehicle, we want to excercise those rights. Especially considering the fact that we can be saving money on gas, avoid spending repair $$ on our vehicle that will eventually be salvaged, AND getting a little bonus cash from the salvage lot (after the $50 dealer) due to our clunker's true scrap value....

Someone above said it well: consumers need to realize that Dealers are on their side in this -- long story short, we're all in the same boat. What I'm sure many customers don't understand is that it is entirely likely that many dealers cannot afford to turn-over the vehicle before they are paid. Not to get too lengthy, but those cars you see sitting on the lot are financed by a bank -- once a customer takes the car home, the dealer only has a week or so to actually pay for that car. That dealer very well may not have an extra $50,000 or $100,000 to give to the bank while he's waiting for reimbursement from Uncle Same. As far as the rules -- they were NEVER spelled-out until mid-way through this administrative fiasco -- so save your calls to the NHTSA, your lawyer, etc. So my advice to consumers? I know you're excited and want your car NOW, but give the dealer a break! Let's face it: you've received a hand-out from the government -- try to exercise a little patience!

Ok I am in the same situation as Steve and many other people apparently where the dealer is refusing to hand over the car. We have done all the paperwork etc etc. We have the clunker in our possesion and we keep on telling them there breaking the law but they seem to not care and will not give us the vehicle because there waiting for the government money.We have reported them to the government(which said they would get back to you in two days it's two weeks later) to the gmc headquarters apparently they can't do anything about it just tell us the dealership is doing it wrong. At this point I don't know what else to do because I bet the government money will not come in for weeks and we have been waiting since early august... Advice?

Steve, the rule clearly states that the "clunker" must be in the control of the dealership prior to them submitting the application. The dealer certifies this when they sign the summary of sale, and when they submit the application. The NHTSA has too many calls and too smal a staff to field the enormous number of questions. The NHTSA has already declaired on their website that:
the dealer must allow you to take delivery of the new car if it is in stock.
the dealer must "capture" the trade in before submitting for reimbursement. The latter part is fraud, so don't let the dealer make the rules. print it from the cars website, take it to the dealer, and kindly ask them to abide by the law before you report them to the nhtsa.

I finally got all of ours in also, yipee!?
Now I wait and wait and wait, will it be a reject or an approval, the suspense is killing me!!

I also have not gotten my new car. My deal was finished July 31st - clunker is still in my possession, my new car is in stock at the dealership, but they say they are waiting for "approval" first. Dealership says waiting for approval before giving the car away is OK, but not waiting for the money – they claim they are waiting for approval, not for the cash to come in. Called the hotline numerous times, called dept of transportation, and called NHTSA. Got differing answers from all as to if I should have my car…however, recently one hotline person told me that it is OK for the dealership to wait for approval. Said that waiting for approval isn’t the same as waiting for the money, which would be in violation if it was approved and they were waiting for money. Still don’t know what to do…approval by my estimation could take a few more weeks….I don’t get it – nobody knows if I should truly have my car or not and that includes the DOT, NHTSA, and even the clunker hotline employees themselves.

YEAH! Just finished the last 1! Not an issue for me but I don't get that the government set a submission deadline..??? What's the logic?

All done..., I agree with Jeff, one monkey off our back, now for the other one named Rejected..

all in!!! now to get back to work. good luck getting paid everyone, I feel like I've been released from a hostage crisis.

Started putting deals in at 1:30 am..
Wife is mad at me, dog is mad at me, I am mad at me.... ARG... only a government run program could leave this many people with a bad taste in their mouths.... they prove the free money always costs someone...

Ok so now that I brought a ton of paperwork home, the site will be offline all night! So I assume the IT department for the government clocked out today around 5pm and let the rest of us sitting around wishing we could get this done!

We only got in for about five minutes. I waited on the hotline for 2 hours to see if they could reject a deal that was logged under the wrong brand for us. He said to send an email that they would get to it in a timely manner. I told we sent the email on Friday morning "How timely are you talking about?" Of course he couldn't help that's another department etc etc, i selected to asked someone about a deal prompt. This is insane.

A little this afternoon, but not at all now -- at least since I started trying again at 7:00 Eastern

is anyone able to get into the site yet?

guess it's another late night for me...

Pennsylvania Auto Dealers just sent this bulletin to me... just passing it along case it is helpful...

To: PAA Members

From: J. Paul McMillen

Date: August 24, 2009 (4:00 PM)

RE: CARS Program Computer System Is Down

Dealers nationwide are reporting that the CARS computer system has either crashed or been shut down, again, for the third time since the federal Department of Transportation (DOT) announced that the Cash for Clunkers Program will end at 8 p.m. (EDT) tonight.

NADA has requested that dealerships that have been unable to successfully submit "clunkers" transactions for whatever reason should immediately e-mail NADA at [email protected], with the subject line "Unable to Submit."
A copy of the e-mail should also be sent to NHTSA at [email protected].
Provide details in the e-mail of the number of transactions you are attempting to transmit, and it might be helpful to include each customer's name, the VIN of their clunker, and the VIN of the new vehicle purchased, as well as the date of sale or lease of the new vehicle. Note in your e-mail that you have been unable to log on to the CARS computer system today to transmit the transactions.

NADA has again called on the Obama Administration to extend the deadline for submitting "cash for clunkers" applications to August 31, while keeping the August 24 deadline for consummating clunkers transactions.

PAA will continue to provide updated information to membership as soon as it becomes available.

sorry... should have read the previous posts... looks like everyone's in the same boat